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My Way to EFI; Many Pictures
Topic Started: Tue Jan 30, 2007 10:53 pm (2,733 Views)
Henger
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Hello cossi friends, her are some Pics of my way to EFI on my 2.5-16v.

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Die Kurbelwelle ist gerichtet, erleichtert und gewuchtet, das Schwungrad ist ebenfalls erleichtert.


Der Block ist frisch gebohrt und gehohnt.


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Hier die Adappterplatte die anstelle des alten Ölfiltergehäuses angeschraubt ist.


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In die Übermaßkolben wurden Taschen gefräst.


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Hier die abgeänderte Riemenscheibe an der nacher das OT Signal abgenommen wird.

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Der neue OT-Geber mit einem aus Alu gefrästen Halter.

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Neue taktende Düsen braucht mein Motor. :mrgreen:

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Mit diesen Nocken (12,4 mm Ventihub) wird der erste Prüfstandlauf gefahren, im Anschluß werden noch andere Nocken getestet.

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Wie hier zu sehen ist, erkläre ich mich solidarisch mit den 2.3er und EvoII Fahrern :wink:, sprich Umbau auf Simplex Steuertrieb.
Der Umbau auf die einfache Kette hat lediglich den Hintergrund, das ich es so haben möchte :P

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Henger
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Diese ganze Gekabels :shock: ist nicht so meine Sache, der Schaltplan vom 16er erinnert mich an den einer F14 oder eines Leo2 Kampfpanzers :lol: :lol:

Der Motoreinbau ist schon eher was für mich :D 8)

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Die neue Zündspule ist endlich verbaut, Ok die Rostflecken im Batteriekasten werde ich bei Gelegenheit noch entfernen :P :P


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Der Elektrolüfter ist verbaut :P :P

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Das ABS und Motorsteuerteil sitzen auf ihrem endgültigen Platz :P :P :P


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Aufgräumt sieht das Ganze nun so aus :D :D


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Die Koffer sind gepackt :wink:


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Ukmerctechie
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Dir is Kool. WKKP Forever!
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Nice work there Henger.
Looking very good and thorough rebuild. B)
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Henger
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Fränk
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Neil
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Amazing work.
I love the red theme (intake looks incredible!)
So we're talking 234bhp?

Nice Carlsson rims btw, i assume you fitted the original rear 15s for Dyno day.
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Henger
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190Evoluzione
Jan 30 2007, 10:13 PM
Amazing work.
I love the red theme (intake looks incredible!)
So we're talking 234bhp?

Nice Carlsson rims btw, i assume you fitted the original rear 15s for Dyno day.

Hello

232,6 bhp in 5.gear (Mercedes Methode) DIN 70020 and 260 NM.

I fitted the original rear rims only for the dyno, my car runs 5-6 hours over two days on the dyno to programm the motormangemant.

Fränk
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Matt
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Very nice indeed. I love looking at engine rebuild pictures. Just great B)

Top work B)
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carl mcgraw
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Sehr schoen..
MFG aus Oxfordshire
(die Ausgewanderten..)
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dave_irl
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Finally I can see the pictures!

Brilliant stuff Fränk :)

So what is happening here then?
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cossie connoisseur
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there can be only one ;-)
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Ok out of curiosity Henger was there internal mods to the block and head?

Quality of work you have done is superb but i would have expected more BHP to be honest, unless im being over optimistic. I noticed the uprated exhaust so you seem to have done a thorough job but i really would have expected near 250bhp with efi and other mods.

Top quality description and pictures by the way B)

Cheers

Nick
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joreto
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One question, is the head for a 2.3-16v, I see that you are using the single row timing chаin ? The 2.5-16v uses the double row timing chain, to my knowledge the single row chain was used only in the 2.3-16v and evo II .
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Henger
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Hello cossi friends,

my English is not the best, I hope this my contribution Basically is translated.

@ Dave irl

In the picture is to be seen an Adappterplate which the original ugly oil filter cases substituted. One could buy the Adappterplate with AMG, however, it is not available any more, which is why we have copied them. One can move the oil filter cartridge now to every place one would want, now mine sits below in the wheel arch.

@ cossie connoisseur

I would also have to me more power wish :-), however, corresponds this resume of the reality. I do not believe this the achievement data of Mercedes one day the reality have corresponded;-) It was the first priority which is the engine after the rebuilding on EFI also good for daily use, we have tested on the Dyno also the big Cams (12.5 mms), besides, other 10 HP come out more, however, then the engine has a bad torque course and is not any more good for daily use.

232.6 bhp have been reached with the original outlet cam and the Atec intake cam (like the Evo II cam).


@ joreto

One can do alterations double row timing chain from 2.5-16v simply on single row chain 2.3-16v, while one exchanges all chainwheels! I have only done this, so that the engine better responds (quick?), it brings none bhp on dyno.

Cheers

Fränk



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Racing
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Original post can be found here;
Franks buildup

Frank has really done a superb job.

The results are on par with our findings.
Have in mind that this 16V isn´t really tuned per se,but the large part of the added HP comes from the stand alone and the freedom in programing it brings.
With that in mind i for one think that the increase in power is downright amazing.

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hal9000
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From the results I've seen of stock 2.3-16's that got dyno tested, Frank has managed to get about a 60% increase in hp over stock. That's pretty impressive all considering.

I didn't realize that ATEC was making cams for the 16V. Does anybody know how many choices they produce, and wether or not they advertise the cam specs?

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Henger
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Some more Pics :rolleyes:

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Die neue Drosselklappe macht einen guten Eindruck :P

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Und wenn sie geöffnet ist erst recht :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

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Drosselklappe und Poti mit Adapter.

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Der neue Benzindruckregler.

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Endlich ist dieses häßliche Ölfiltergehäuse verschwunden, an deren Stelle sitzt nun eine schlanke Adapterplatte mit zwei Schlauchabgängen :D :D

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Das Druckrohr find ich einfach geil :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: da geht das Herz eines jeden Alufetischisten auf 8)

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Place of the Oilfilter>>>>

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Cheers

Fränk
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dave_irl
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Finally I can see more pictures :rolleyes: the simple joy of broadband in a net cafe :D

Fränk, is your oil filter under the intake manifold??


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I like that little take off block you have, very nice, where did you get it? It would be handy to put the filter and pressure sensor somewhere else, especially if fitting oil cooler, or dry sump etc.

Thanks
Dave

;)
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Henger
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Hi Dave,

no the oil filter is not under the intake manifold, with this adapter plate you can place it were you want, my one ist under the car. I took some pics of it for you and show them in this thread.
Temp-sensor and oil pressure -sensor are on the adapter plate.

Adapter plate you can buy at Atec, last price for it i know was 150,- Euro.


Here are some information and prices for the whole EFI kit by Atec.

http://www.atecmotoren.com/html/service.html

Phone. +49 6861 939245

Sorry my english is to bad, so only in german.

Hallo Leute,

hier mal ein paar Bilder des kompletten Kit in der Basis Ausführung.

Zu sehen die gefrästen Aluteile.

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Drosselklappenstutzen.


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Drosselklappe 70mm.


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Der Kit komplett.


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Im einzelnen (werde nur die wichtigen Komponenten aufzählen).

1x Gaszug & Halter (Alu)

1x Drosselklappengehäuse 70mm & Poti

1x Adaptergehäuse Drosselklappe

1x Konus Luftfiltergehäuse

1x K&N Luftfilter

1x Benzindruckregler & Halter

1x Leerlaufregelventil

1x Kabelbaum komplett

1x Motorsteuergerät

4x Einspritzdüse &Dichtringe

1x Ansaugluft -Temp Fühler

4x Dichtung Ansaugrohr/Sammler

1x Dichtung Ansaugrohr

1x Benzindruckrohr & 2 Abstandshalter (Alu)

1x OT -Geber & Halter

1x Anschluß M14x1,5

3x Anschlußnippel

1x 1,7 m Benzinschlauch 8mm

1x 2 m Schlauch 3mm

1x Gummischlauch 83 mm

1x Motorentlüftungsschlauch

1x Schaltplan

1x Einbauanleitung

Dazu kommen jede Menge Schrauben,Muttern, Scheiben, Schellen, Halter und Kleingedöns.

Im Preis enthalten sind der Schwingungsdämpfer (Austausch!!!!)
Und folgende Arbeiten durch Atec sind auch im Preis enthalten. Anpassung der Bohrung für den Drosselklappenstutzen am Luftsammler, desweitern müssen die Bohrungen für die Einspritzdüsen in der Ansaugbrücke gefräst werden.

Natürlich ist auf dem Motorsteuergerät das entsprechende Programm hinterlegt!!!!

Preis für den Basis-Kit zum Selbsteinbau!!
2990,- Euro ohne Mwst.

3558,- mit Mwst.


Zu den Kosten des Einbaus durch Atec, muß ich erst Rücksprache halten, jedoch könnt ihr einfach dort anrufen und selbst nachfragen.

Natürlich gibt es auch einen Erweiterungs-Kit mit Nockenwelle, geänderter Zündanlage usw. dazu werde ich morgen einen weiteren Beitrag einstellen.

Gruß Fränk
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cossie connoisseur
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there can be only one ;-)
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Quote:
 
From the results I've seen of stock 2.3-16's that got dyno tested, Frank has managed to get about a 60% increase in hp over stock. That's pretty impressive all considering.


Ok im confused now, is this car a 2.5 or a 2.3? as all the pics seem to show its a 2.5. If so then the gains aint great BUT if it is a 2.3-16v then the gains are superb.

Super project i would like to point out again. I will do something like this one day but not till i get a garage and moved out of the family home :)

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joreto
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cossie connoisseur
Feb 7 2007, 02:35 PM
Quote:
 
From the results I've seen of stock 2.3-16's that got dyno tested, Frank has managed to get about a 60% increase in hp over stock. That's pretty impressive all considering.


Ok im confused now, is this car a 2.5 or a 2.3? as all the pics seem to show its a 2.5. If so then the gains aint great BUT if it is a 2.3-16v then the gains are superb.

Super project i would like to point out again. I will do something like this one day but not till i get a garage and moved out of the family home :)

The car is a 2.5-16v. Henger, does the single timing chain make that much more responsive ? BTW have you dynoed with the original intake cam, I'm interested what gains can be had only from ke-jet to EFI conversion.
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hal9000
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cossie connoisseur
Feb 7 2007, 07:35 AM
Quote:
 
From the results I've seen of stock 2.3-16's that got dyno tested, Frank has managed to get about a 60% increase in hp over stock. That's pretty impressive all considering.


Ok im confused now, is this car a 2.5 or a 2.3? as all the pics seem to show its a 2.5. If so then the gains aint great BUT if it is a 2.3-16v then the gains are superb.

Super project i would like to point out again. I will do something like this one day but not till i get a garage and moved out of the family home :)

Sorry for the confustion CC, here's a clarification of what I meant.

From the tests I've seen of 2.3-16's they dyno out around 140-145 hp at the wheel (whp). Since the 2.5-16 only had 10 more crank hp (chp) than the 2.3-16 (185 chp vs 195 chp right?), the wheel hp should be something close. Call the stock 2.5-16 around 155 whp for argument's sake... Maybe somebody has some real numbers to throw out though.

If Frank is getting over 230 hp at the wheels now, that's a pretty impressive gain wether the engine be a 2.3 or 2.5L. I don't know if there's a specific number for drivetrain loss for our cars, but I always learned that it was 15 to 25% on average. 230 whp would end up being in the neighborhood of 260 to 280 Crank hp if those loss figures are accurate.

I'd say that's an impressive gain for a NA engine that's going into (assumption here..) a street car and run on pump gas.
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joreto
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hal9000
Feb 8 2007, 01:24 AM
cossie connoisseur
Feb 7 2007, 07:35 AM
Quote:
 
From the results I've seen of stock 2.3-16's that got dyno tested, Frank has managed to get about a 60% increase in hp over stock. That's pretty impressive all considering.


Ok im confused now, is this car a 2.5 or a 2.3? as all the pics seem to show its a 2.5. If so then the gains aint great BUT if it is a 2.3-16v then the gains are superb.

Super project i would like to point out again. I will do something like this one day but not till i get a garage and moved out of the family home :)

Sorry for the confustion CC, here's a clarification of what I meant.

From the tests I've seen of 2.3-16's they dyno out around 140-145 hp at the wheel (whp). Since the 2.5-16 only had 10 more crank hp (chp) than the 2.3-16 (185 chp vs 195 chp right?), the wheel hp should be something close. Call the stock 2.5-16 around 155 whp for argument's sake... Maybe somebody has some real numbers to throw out though.

If Frank is getting over 230 hp at the wheels now, that's a pretty impressive gain wether the engine be a 2.3 or 2.5L. I don't know if there's a specific number for drivetrain loss for our cars, but I always learned that it was 15 to 25% on average. 230 whp would end up being in the neighborhood of 260 to 280 Crank hp if those loss figures are accurate.

I'd say that's an impressive gain for a NA engine that's going into (assumption here..) a street car and run on pump gas.

I was under the impression that thats the figure at the flywheel, he is putting out 144,7 PS at the wheels in 5-th gear and the dyno has calculated 93 PS for drivetrain losses so 144.7 + 93 = 237.7 PS at the flywheel (uncorrected) ..... that is if I'm reading the dyno graph correctly :)
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cossie connoisseur
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Ok that clarifies that up nicely. I would love to see the aditional gain with racing fuel.

Oh and your right about the bhp figures for a NA 16v as a Euro one pre cat will have another 10bhp

Also crank hp seems fine B)
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joreto
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Yes those are good numbers, but I always thought that with such mods the 2.5-16v should be close to 250 - 260 bhp at the crank, but as Raceing stated the car is not fully tuned for power so there might be some more bhp to be had ;) . Anyway thats a superb done job .
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Henger
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Hello

To make it short, the achievement measurements took place under correct conditions, so standart petrol 95 roz octane of the gas station. The test bench was a Maha LPS 2000, one test bench admitted by Mercedes. I believe not that the original HP angabe from Mercedes concerning 194 HP with the 2.5-16V cat. from the vehicles was reached. In a German car Magazine a 2.5-16V cat. on the test bench was measured, result 133 kW to German Institute for Standardization (DIN) 70020 in the fourth way (gear,speed) ...... was not any more.

Our attempt with big cams (12.5 mms) brought other 10 HP on the Dyno, however, then the engine is not suited for everyday life from charakteristik any more. The rebuilding on single cain brings on the Dyno certainly no additional HP, but the engine is something respons with it, I simply wanted to make good it, and if I make already easier the crankshaft and the Flyweel, I make also easier the time chain desire.

Sorry for this english by translator.


Fränk
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Henger
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@ dave_irl

Hi dave, here are Pics of the new place of the oil filter, filter is from VW model, cheap and easy to change :)

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Fränk
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hal9000
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Is that an Evo I front lip/splitter on your front bumper? There has been some discussion on this side of the pond about wether it would fit a stock 16V bumper properly.
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dave_irl
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All makes sense now Fränk!

That is a much better place for the filter ;)

I think I might do something similar...
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Henger
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@ hal9000

Hi,

i use the original EvoI lip and splitter (Schwert) at the normal bumper from the 2.5-16V>>>
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The prob is, the bumper of the EvoI is on the side 2 cm shorter, so you have to cut the lipp each side 2 cm>>>
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:wub:

Fränk
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