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| Engine swap; Any hints & tips? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Wed Feb 28, 2007 12:23 pm (1,361 Views) | |
| Conrad | Wed Feb 28, 2007 12:23 pm Post #1 |
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Therapy Needed
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Next weekend I shall be attempting my egnine swap, with my dad. He's done quite a few engines before, mainly VWs on his beach buggies and he used to make pumps so he's installed them on them. Any specific things I have to be aware of? Any hints and tips? 2.5-16 AUTO. Thanks! |
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| cossie connoisseur | Wed Feb 28, 2007 12:27 pm Post #2 |
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there can be only one ;-)
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Did you try what Hal said in your last topic about fushing the engine. I did some digging and it will work unless major damage has occured
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| Matt | Wed Feb 28, 2007 12:51 pm Post #3 |
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Administrator - Hawk Eye
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Hmmm, its a pretty easy job really, a couple of tricky areas to get the spanner in but just remember where everything goes
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| Conrad | Wed Feb 28, 2007 2:00 pm Post #4 |
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Therapy Needed
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I intended to, but was talked out of it - problem is, what happens if it seizes and I'm miles from home? I'll take the engine out and do it, and maybe try it afterwards.
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| cossie connoisseur | Wed Feb 28, 2007 2:06 pm Post #5 |
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there can be only one ;-)
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Engine wont seize and its something that can be completed on your drive on a saturday afternoon and leave it to dry overnight whilst on the piss
Just would save so much bull ache and will also mean you will have a spare engine to sell! |
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| Conrad | Wed Feb 28, 2007 2:27 pm Post #6 |
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Therapy Needed
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Hmm, I think you may just be right... I'll hang on to the spare engine though, just incase! Just need to finish putting mine back together... |
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| cossie connoisseur | Wed Feb 28, 2007 2:29 pm Post #7 |
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there can be only one ;-)
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Ok bud, keep us posted. When that engine is cleaned out you will know in the first 5 minutes of idle how its going to pan out Use the spare engine as a blank canvas if you know what i mean
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| Conrad | Wed Feb 28, 2007 2:47 pm Post #8 |
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Therapy Needed
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My worry though is that they still never told me why there's no oil pressure. So even if I do do that, do you reckon that may clear out the lines if there's a blockage? |
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| cossie connoisseur | Wed Feb 28, 2007 2:50 pm Post #9 |
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there can be only one ;-)
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Oil pumps dont go on these cars (its just so rare), so i would say doing this cleaning procedure will be the best way in my mind to clear it out. They are very strong components. But there is only one way of finding out
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| kentronix | Wed Feb 28, 2007 6:10 pm Post #10 |
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I'm only really here for the Kitchens
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one tip for doing anything but particularly major jobs. take a camera and stick it in a sandwich bag (avoid greasy fingers). Take pics as often as possible. Plus you can post them on here afterwards
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| hal9000 | Wed Feb 28, 2007 6:33 pm Post #11 |
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Part of things
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Hmm I missed the part about no oil pressure somehow. I don't remember if there's a screen on the oil pickup. If there is then that might just be clogged with grit and flushing like I suggested will probably work. But if there's no screen or if the grit was finer than the pickup screen then you may have got grit in the passages which is blocking oil flow. If that's the case then you're going to want to try to clear out the oil passages as well. That's a bit tougher and the chances of success are a bit lower. There are a number of places where you can open the oil system. I'm not sure where they all are on the 16V block, but off hand you can use the oil filter adapter passages, the oil pressure sender passage, and any gallery plugs (if they have threaded plugs). What I would consider trying would be to open all of these passages up and use compressed air (or better yet, a compressed air solvent sprayer) to flush the lines as thoroughly as possible. You want to try to flush in the reverse direction of normal oil flow. This has the potential to be messy as solvent and grit will probably try to blow back out of the open holes. Plan accordingly. Do this before you do the complete engine flush so that you can wash out any debris you dislodge. As Cossie Con said, you'll know pretty quick wether or not this operation is successful. If the engine is going to sieze, it will happen within a few miles of normal opration or not at all. What you won't be able to tell right away is how much non-fatal damage the grit may have already done to the moving parts of the engine. You'll want to pay close attention to your oil pressure to see if the oil pump is still working as it should and the bearings are still tight. You'll also want to watch oil consumption and listen carefully to the engine sounds (especially at startup) over the next few thousand miles. Also, I've been thinking. Considering the original source of the grit was the valve cover and the design of the head, has lots of pockets, when/if you do the engine flush, it would also be a goood idea to pull the valve cover and visually check for grit in the area of the cams. Flushing might not remove grit from this area. |
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| hal9000 | Wed Feb 28, 2007 6:36 pm Post #12 |
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Part of things
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Regarding the engine swap: If it comes down to it, I'd suggest pulling both the engine and transmission out, swapping the transmisison, and then reinstalling both together. My experience is that there is so little space around the bell housing that it's actually more work to remove all the bell housing bolts than it is to just pull everyting at once. |
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| Conrad | Wed Feb 28, 2007 6:46 pm Post #13 |
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Therapy Needed
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Thanks Scott, the pickup does have a mesh screen, but that was perfectly clear. Just pondering over what the mechanic did. He's charged £52.64 to tell me that he has found grit in the engine - he didn't tell me where he found it, or how. I wonder if he blew compressed air in and perhaps has already cleared the blockage. I won't know until I finish re-assembling it and start it up. |
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| hal9000 | Wed Feb 28, 2007 9:08 pm Post #14 |
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Part of things
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You should be able to get a little more info out of the mechanic. Just ask him. How far apart is your engine right now? |
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| Conrad | Wed Feb 28, 2007 9:55 pm Post #15 |
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Therapy Needed
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Sump (oil pan to you) needs final tightening up - I had all the bolts in place, but only to finger tightness. Alternator and belt tensioner need refitting, and the inlet manifold needs a couple of nuts, which I have but am yet to put on. |
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| big al merc | Wed Feb 28, 2007 10:57 pm Post #16 |
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Highly Addicted
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i second that but note which gear rod goes where
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| smiffy | Thu Mar 1, 2007 3:57 am Post #17 |
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just strumming me paws...........hum-de-hum!
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think about it conrad,with a spare engine sitting there........you could afford to take your time and rebuild to the spec you want
you,ll never ever lose money on the spare block.wish you luck in swapping over engines.....dont forget to tie up the exhaust flange so to stop the full weight of it buggering up your ex mounts and rubber flex.
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| Conrad | Thu Mar 1, 2007 9:26 am Post #18 |
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Therapy Needed
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Thanks mate - all advice appreciated! Just remembered the other major reason I can't use my existing engine... the timing chain guide rail is disintegrating... |
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| cossie connoisseur | Thu Mar 1, 2007 9:51 am Post #19 |
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there can be only one ;-)
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I take it the previous owner took no care over the car at all Conrad
I forgot about that too but to clean you current engine best and quickly to asess damage without any dimatling will be whilst it is still in your engine bay. I would still clean her, try her out, if the problem even starts to show up then swap the engines over, then use the new engine as a daily runner and strip the original engine apart completly. Then you will gradually with part of your monthly paypacket develop the engine into something more powerful and as you wont be on a time or financial budget it can take as long as you like This is how i would play it. Oh and you costs will be kept lower as your engine will be striped and it will be easier to do things like send off the cylinder head and put new pistons in ect
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| Conrad | Mon Mar 5, 2007 11:38 am Post #20 |
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Therapy Needed
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Picked the engine up yesterday - thanks Steve! You're right, Nick. This car has been pretty abused along the line. The engine is absolutely coated in oil from the rocker cover gasket never being changed; it had gone literally hard and brittle and was leaking all over the place. The paintwork is in bad condition too, but at least there's no rust (my mate who owns a bodyshop checked it over for me, including under the bodykit etc). Oh well, when I bought it I knew it was going to be a bit of a project, so I'm not angry at all. What I'm worried about now, with this engine swap, is that Hal & Al said to pull the transmission out too, but will the bowden cable etc need re-adjusting? I really have no idea how they work, and I've always tried to avoid working on them where possible. |
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| Conrad | Mon Mar 5, 2007 7:49 pm Post #21 |
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Therapy Needed
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And the other thing - cruise control. Is there anything specific I have to be aware of/move about when changing the engine? I'll be nicking my existing inlet manifold & throttle body etc to put on the new engine, so I think that's the extra accelerator thing covered? |
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| hal9000 | Mon Mar 5, 2007 9:23 pm Post #22 |
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Part of things
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These cars have a hydraulic clutch - thus no bowden tube to worry about. You WILL have to disconnect the clutch line and when you put everything back together you'll have to bleed the clutch, which can be a royal PITA. Regarding the CC and other accessories: I imagine that you might have to deal with some minor adjusting to get everything back to spec once it's re-installed, but I can't imagine any problems other than that. Just make good records of what things you removed, and in what order. |
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| Conrad | Sat Mar 10, 2007 1:12 pm Post #23 |
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Therapy Needed
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Thanks Scott - but it's an auto.
Took lots of photos of the new engine today, but my friend who is meant to be fetching my car has left me standing. Very annoying as today the weather started off nicely so I could have got a few hours in. Gone all cloudy and about to rain now though. I'm going to do a "build diary" on this, if there's any demand for it? There are lots of bit to swap over from the old to the new (you cut the oil lines, Steve!), but nothing complicated (holding thumbs). But once the main thing is in motion I'll be taking photos along the way. My boss has bet me a tenner I won't have it done in 6 weeks, so now I have some urgency behind me. I'm aiming for it to be done before Rich27 comes to Norwich, but I don't see that happening unfortunately.
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| Conrad | Sat Mar 17, 2007 3:22 pm Post #24 |
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Therapy Needed
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Snagged at the first obstacle. Disconnected everything from the engine, thought we could manage without removing the gearbox too - got all the bolts except one! So now we've had to go back a few steps and start removing the slam panel so we can slide it forward instead of upwards. How the hell do you get the slam panel off?! |
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| Neil | Sat Mar 17, 2007 3:43 pm Post #25 |
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Newbie
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Thought it was only removable on the 2.6s...? |
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| Conrad | Sat Mar 17, 2007 3:45 pm Post #26 |
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Therapy Needed
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Failing that, how do I get the engine and gearbox out as one? |
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| big al merc | Sat Mar 17, 2007 5:39 pm Post #27 |
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Highly Addicted
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i would say if you have got the majority of the bolts out i would just struggle a bit more and keep working on that last bolt it will come out
which bolt are you stuck on? |
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| Conrad | Sat Mar 17, 2007 6:01 pm Post #28 |
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Therapy Needed
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The one next to the top starter motor bolt. No chance I can even get my hand any further than poking it with my middle finger.
Next question: How do I disconnect the gearbox from the propshaft? There seems to be some sort of iron band round the top of the bolts so I can't get to them! |
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| Conrad | Sat Mar 17, 2007 7:49 pm Post #29 |
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Therapy Needed
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What 6 litres of transmission fluid in the face does to you. |
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| Uk Merc Man | Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:02 am Post #30 |
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190e Leg-End
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yeah....i was a little brutal when i took the engine out of mine, i was fast running out of time and i was also working alone, i cut the slam panel out and pulled the engine/box forward......on my own, god i'm hard
dont worry though, thats a good lump you've got there....the heart of G977 EGM lives on....god, i miss that car...
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| Neil | Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:23 am Post #31 |
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Newbie
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Loving that rocker-cover Steve - GOLD! Gold, always believe in your.... |
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| big al merc | Sun Mar 18, 2007 11:38 am Post #32 |
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Highly Addicted
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make you smile? :lol: :lol: |
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| Conrad | Sun Mar 18, 2007 12:12 pm Post #33 |
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Therapy Needed
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I'm just a happy person! |
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| nickaliath | Sun Mar 18, 2007 12:26 pm Post #34 |
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Bodywork Specialist
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RE: No oil pressure at top of posts. I had this problem when i bought my evo first. The previous owner had slipped the chain, due to revving it straight off starting! <_< It caused the chain to crack the oil pump housing and in turn give no oil pressure! Oil pressure is sorted now and stays at 3 whilst driving and just a hair under whilst idling.
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| stwat | Mon Mar 19, 2007 12:32 am Post #35 |
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I thought you had to remove the front slam panel radiator and headlights etc to get the engine and box out. Or have you already done that, and ifso il just shut up :lol:
Stu |
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I'm aiming for it to be done before Rich27 comes to Norwich, but I don't see that happening unfortunately.
2:01 AM Jul 11