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| Turbo Questions Guys-in Here | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Sun Aug 26, 2007 8:43 pm (29,809 Views) | |
| dave_irl | Thu Nov 29, 2007 3:31 pm Post #201 |
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Defector
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Thanks! what would you think about some clutch plates like these? SPORT, "FIBER-CARBON" SPRUNG HUB CLUTCH DISC SMOOTH LOCK" MARCEL SPRUNG HUB CLUTCH DISC SPORT, "KEVLAR" Ū SPRUNG HUB CLUTCH DISC KEVLARŪ Im a little confused by the various options... More importantly however, I have a 275 from a 23-16 to go into my car, but can I still use my flywheel from the 1.8 engine? I havent measured it but maybe most M102 share same dimension flywheel, albeit with different weights of course.. Or do I now need a 2.3-16 Fwheel too? :unsure: I think that could be too heavy for my engine, I plan on lightening the original one anyway.. once it fits with the new 2.3-16 clutch and getrag! :wacko: Thanks! |
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| hal9000 | Thu Nov 29, 2007 5:15 pm Post #202 |
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Jesper, Since you cut out the "dual mass" part of the flywheel when lightening it anyway, would it make sense to start with a single mass flywheel instead, or does it really not matter? The only reason I ask is that I believe that both single and dual mass flywheels were available for the m102 engine. Also, for the "correct install height" for the 618 clutch that you're talking about... That's just a spacer block that you attach to the release bearing, right? Could you maybe take a pic of that setup when you get a chance if it's still around? |
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| Racing | Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:35 pm Post #203 |
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Nope.Donīt have anyone around at the moment.Make em for customers on a more or less regular basis though. To my knowledge thereīs only dual mass for the 102-then again i might be wrong.Dual mass is all iīve seen though. Easiest way to remedy "correct height" for the release bearing would be to just shim underneath the ball in the gearbox housing. Dave. I believe that the "smaller" engines use a 215mm clutch while the valvers use a 228. Nothing a couple of minutes in a lathe wont handle tho.. That aside,the flywheel itself fits.No probs. As for the clutch plate/driven discs...canīt really say anything about those as iīve never tried them. Racers around here tho swear by a plate by the name of "black magic". Obviously something Kennedy/Gene berg markets? |
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| Racing | Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:39 pm Post #204 |
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Btw. A "marcel" is just a "cushioning spring" between the disc and the disc material to soften the lockup of the clutch. |
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| hal9000 | Thu Nov 29, 2007 7:31 pm Post #205 |
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Hadn't thought of shimming the ball, I'm glad I asked. You get the height you need to shim by measuring the difference between installed height of the stock and modded clutch at the contact surface of the release bearing, right? |
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| Racing | Fri Nov 30, 2007 9:55 am Post #206 |
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Yuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuup. |
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| Racing | Fri Nov 30, 2007 10:36 am Post #207 |
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Been offered these.![]() ![]() Forget the centers as i for one think theyīre way out of place on a w201,but the rest.? Hubs and rims at least are reusable. Dimensions are,for now at least,9*18. Wheel centers are totaly interchangable as is offset if need be as the wheel for racing more often than not are modular. Would this be over the top for a build like mine,or should i go for it? Centerbolt wheels kind of oooze of racing IMO.. |
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| Big Ben | Fri Nov 30, 2007 10:40 am Post #208 |
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Sneaky 2.5-16 Driver!
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Go for it!
But for Gods sake put a lock pin through the nut! |
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| Neil | Fri Nov 30, 2007 10:45 am Post #209 |
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Dude, you're more of a motorsport tyre expert than any of us. If you think you can get the rubber you'd need for Centre-lock 18s then maybe go for it but tbh I think it could become extraordinarily expensive unless you can tap into a good supply of tyres. The best wheel design, of course, would be: ![]() With this also being v. popular...
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| Racing | Fri Nov 30, 2007 11:09 am Post #210 |
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Centre hub solution belongs to a friend of mine,and is actualy intended for an Audi-which sports the same C/C bolt wise as the mercs. Yeah..iīm tapped in when it comes to tyres..donīt fret. (Used to be X michelin tech) Slicks,intermediate or rain...same crap different day in my book.. Buuuut...as you note..the EVOII design would look WAY better,and the thing is that another close friend of mine whoīs a die hard roadracer(former pro) has a set of brand new speedline magnesiums ,which are centerbolt as well, laying around... Flat black with "speedline" written down one of the spokes.. |
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| RobertE | Fri Nov 30, 2007 11:15 am Post #211 |
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Serial victim...
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Well, they would be perfect, Jesper. I've got the narrower Evo2s made by Speedline and I think they're the best-looking alloy wheels I've ever laid eyes on. |
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| Neil | Fri Nov 30, 2007 11:25 am Post #212 |
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Oh yes, they have that 'milled from a solid block' look down to a t. Not completely unlike:
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| dave_irl | Fri Nov 30, 2007 11:33 am Post #213 |
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Defector
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Centre bolt is mega cool!!
If any car was worthy...Do it! Are there different types/diameters of centremounting or are they all the same? And whats the big issue with tyres, are the wheels strange sizes? |
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| hal9000 | Fri Nov 30, 2007 5:24 pm Post #214 |
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I'm still kicking myself for not picking up the center lock ronals which I had a chance to get a few years back (they ended up in the hands of another rev member). I say do it. If you don't like them, you can always send them back out the front door to the next interested party. |
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| Racing | Fri Nov 30, 2007 6:37 pm Post #215 |
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Dave. No,not really. Itīs just that racing wheels often take "large" tyres-read expensive. Iīll try and get a snap of the speedlines as soon as my friend is back from greece. Heīs got a rather large boat laying around one of the docks around that place somewhere that needed attention.. |
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| dave_irl | Sat Dec 1, 2007 11:06 am Post #216 |
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Defector
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Ahhhh.. haha the simple (read cheap) joys of 215/40/16! Speedlines are cool, also nice in 6 spoke.. you'll probably be on 18"s at least? something fat at the rear to put the power down, or, to paint wider black lines on the road
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| Racing | Sat Dec 1, 2007 12:31 pm Post #217 |
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Thereīll be more than one set of wheels Dave. For more..."serious" work iīve got a pair of 26*10,5*15 MT streets laying around. Hence the need for more fender out back.. Centerbolts is a different matter tho,and the idea is to use those for more "casual" work. Ie-regular driving around. |
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| Enthusiast | Mon Dec 3, 2007 12:32 pm Post #218 |
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"Centerbolts is a different matter tho,and the idea is to use those for more "casual" work. Ie-regular driving around. " "an Audi-which sports the same C/C bolt" does that mean you just shuffle the hub and can change? Vesper yours is an extreme special so guess changing wheels is not a problem for you I want to see the most extreme! I'm a bit bored with think track black - seen it on Range Rover Sports and every other white Elise. Those race car wheels win for me... |
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| Enthusiast | Mon Dec 3, 2007 12:34 pm Post #219 |
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Wheels for me 15inch OEM until I saw Robert's Evo II with series 1 bodykit. Makes it does make the car look more special and give more grip.... looses the softer ride i guess |
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| Racing | Sat Dec 8, 2007 12:54 am Post #220 |
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Update time then lads. 3.5" exhaust..apple racing backbox..runs the entire lenght of the car til the downpipe..which is a full 4". In an effort to make the chassis cope and become at least remotely adjustable...these for instance are the upper front shock mounts.just out of 6082aluminium. Of course theyīre bound for a trip to the anodizer bath as well...with a STRICT eye for antything BUT bling colours.. On the same note,rear subframe bushings out of Delrin plastic.(Acetal) Point being that itīs about as hard as soft aluminium..but more resistant to transmitting noise due to its cellular build. |
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| Mohammad | Sat Dec 8, 2007 6:17 pm Post #221 |
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weneakhborz
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nice.lovin it |
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| dave_irl | Sat Dec 8, 2007 7:19 pm Post #222 |
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Defector
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Nice job on the subframe bushings! Where do you get them or do you make them too? I presume they need a little more work as the subframe holes are not exactly 100% round? ps would installation not be a little trickier compared to the interferance fit of the rubber ones that "squish" a little? that back end is going to be seriously tight
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| Racing | Sat Dec 8, 2007 7:26 pm Post #223 |
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Nah,we make em in the lathe out of 80mm Delrin bar stock. Only drawback is that the delrin(acetal plastic) isnīt exactly cheap..but hey..canīt win em all. Have used these in numerous cars by now and they make for one SERIOUS difference. Both in stability of the rear power train as well as how the car tracks on the road. The difference is out of thos world really-seing itīs a street going car after all. What you "pay" is a SLIGHTLY increased rear end noise,but for a high performance car..whatever kind of..(turns into a slight kind of background whine-thatīs all) Thing with the derlin is that is IS slightly compressible. Not like the rubber by far,and we usualy end up making them approx 1/10 of a mm oversize for the hole-which is 66.00 by the way. Yup. Youīre correct. They need a tad more work. What needs to be done is to saw a little piece off to cater to the "out of round" of the hole. Take a whole of maybe 2 min a piece with a common hack saw. (I use a penumatic one for cleaner and straighter cuts) |
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| dave_irl | Sat Dec 8, 2007 7:44 pm Post #224 |
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Very interesting! My back end was all over the place and the old bushings I removed were totally shot. Hard to believe a metal tube stuck to some rubber is what holds the frame to the car.. you could really feel it wandering on the motorway, not to mention the squeaky noises. Some slightly increased road noise is nothing to pay for better handling, eitherway nothing a nicely breathing exhaust wont drown out.. How expensive? as the OEM things are pretty pricey as it is..over here anyway. I'd be quite willing to buy a set from you if you would be interested in making some more up, seeing as the frame is out and prepped now, and I only ever want to do that bushing job ONCE
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| Racing | Sat Dec 8, 2007 7:50 pm Post #225 |
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Welp. The brakes of the C32 really ARE massive. Makes the shock in the background seem...petite even. Rotors are whatīs known as curved vane. Ie;the cooling effect is due to air being taken into the disc from the center of it and pushed outwards by the rotation of the wheel. THatīs how all vented rotors work. A curved vane though has the colling "fins" at a curvature to mainly increase stiffness of the rotor under nigh loads. Whatīs to be seen in the pic is something else though... When you put these brakes on a 190 series car the calipers wonīt really center of the rotors. Not the end of the world for a modern setup as the pistons will auto compensate for it,but not the correct way to set it up either. In this pic there has been 2.5mm(0,1") thick shims added to the calipers where they mate to the upright,and as can be seen it does NOT suffice to center the caliper. To get this right..is very much a trial n error job,and due to that i opted to siply turn "trial" shims out of aluminium as itīs way way faster to make those on the lathe. If you look where the caliper bolts to the upright you can see a shiny aluminium piece.Thatīs the shim. Of course these need to be made out of steel when doing the final setup.(Aluminium wont cope the loads involved) |
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| Racing | Sat Dec 8, 2007 7:55 pm Post #226 |
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Btw. To make these brakes a true bolt on,i had to make them a "bolt apart" first. See..when you just install these brakes the pressure port will end up right into the upright. Which..of course is a no can do(this as these brakes are mounted the other side of the upright on the C32). Well... What i did was just take them apart and so to say let the center sections of both calipers trade place. Presto..torq wrench at 60Nm...and calipers back toghether..which just fits. Apart from that,you need slightly longer brake hoses OR you could opt to make a short hardline "extension" from the caliper to the hose i guess. Mine will be slightly longer metal braided teflon lines tho.. Speaking of which.. These brakes ARE italian with all that brings along. Something i reflected strongly on was when losening the torx bolts for the caliper halves. Those bolts will be tossed in the bin as far as iīm concerned. They are M10...and canīt even cope with ANY load inxs of 60Nm. Ie...garbage... |
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| Mohammad | Sun Dec 9, 2007 7:18 pm Post #227 |
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weneakhborz
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nice work man.i love your work. |
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| Racing | Sun Dec 9, 2007 10:59 pm Post #228 |
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Thank you. Altho a lot of it are brainchilds of mine..i guess iīm the one with the most anticipation of the outcome. In short..itīs nice to see something like this "grow" in your hands. |
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| hal9000 | Mon Dec 10, 2007 2:13 am Post #229 |
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I remember there being some discussion about the C32 brake modification on another forum. Some other people raised the concern that even modified to fit the 190 as you did, the calipers are oriented differently than on the C32. Nobody seemed too sure about it, but they were concerned that since the pistons are of different sizes, that uneven brake pad wear (from end to end) might be a problem for the conversion. I'm just curious if you had looked into the issue. |
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| Racing | Mon Dec 10, 2007 11:05 am Post #230 |
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Yes we have,and the differences are minute. As stated earlier these are already iinstalled on Kims EVO,and what can i say...i simply works. As always Scott..theory and practice seldome goes totaly hand in hand... On my car tho weīve had them setup a little different than on Kims car if iīm on the money. The "little things" are always was sets one install apart from the other i guess. Itīs nothing i worry about tho..hafta admit to that. |
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| dennisbots | Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:05 pm Post #231 |
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omg somebody here has got an sun treatment. laserhead.gif Thought only white blonds where over there. Which i have to check out by myself btw because i heard a lot of good things of the Scandinavian girls. |
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| cossie connoisseur | Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:29 pm Post #232 |
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there can be only one ;-)
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cool thread.................oh if i won the lottery the possibilities would be endless
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| Lewis 190E 2.5 16 | Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:34 pm Post #233 |
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W201
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Give yourself half a chance... You can start by getting rid of some of those pink cars :lol: Only joking Jesper, those C32's look tasty.. What Brake servo will you be using to go with them? |
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| jeremy | Mon Dec 10, 2007 6:11 pm Post #234 |
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Too Far Gone To Help
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Look i know i'm new here but omygawd, is this mercedes benz or mensa benz? |
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| RobertE | Mon Dec 10, 2007 6:26 pm Post #235 |
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Serial victim...
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There are, believe me, people on here who really - really - know their stuff.
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| Racing | Mon Dec 10, 2007 10:31 pm Post #236 |
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Like Conrad...itīs ALL conrad i tell you... Dennis. For the sake of argument...nah...iīm about as caucasian as they come for better for worse.. Tell you what tho...iīm gonna get yelled at for it,but iīll change that avatar for ONE day exactly starting tonite-if i can make it work-for one that actualy IS better...but not exactly work friendly..whatever..if they canīt take a joke..F em.. :lol: Like i said...ONE day..then...for something completely different. As for the scandinavian wimmins...yup..you heard correctly.. Lewis. The stock one as far as booster and the 500SL master cylinder. |
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| Racing | Mon Dec 10, 2007 10:36 pm Post #237 |
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Dennis btw. That avatar more to your liking?
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| Conrad | Mon Dec 10, 2007 10:54 pm Post #238 |
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Therapy Needed
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I'm glad you've realised my genius. :lol: :lol: Hey, everyone has to learn at some point. My learning curve has been somewhat slow, but I'm getting there in my own time. The previous avatar was genius, I had to giggle about it. |
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| Racing | Mon Dec 10, 2007 11:03 pm Post #239 |
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Then....your wish is my command. Back to Tupac in a hurry.. |
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| Racing | Tue Dec 11, 2007 7:49 pm Post #240 |
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As iīm a little involved both here and there...iīm proud to tell that some friends within the VEMS gang just dynoed the bigblock chevy of Christell racing. On 1.6 bars of boost...it put out almost 1900hp ON PUMP GAS. Yep..on regular Shell V-power... Thatīs some NASTY numbers for a mundane streeter... :lol: |
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If any car was worthy...Do it!

:lol: 
9:33 AM Jul 11