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Weapons Grade 124 !; 124 500ce "MANUAL"
Topic Started: Fri Jun 18, 2010 9:21 pm (3,485 Views)
OSIRIS V8
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Rich27
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Very nice, any more info?

Also taking pictures of it by the wheely bins is a no no :P
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stwat
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Ooo lovely B) More pics and info please :)
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blankcanvas
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serious car...verging on rocketship
this is the man doing my v8 w123 coupe :)
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OSIRIS V8
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Hi all and "blankcanvas"
This little toy is what we call our developement vehicle and is still a work in progress.
As far as we know its the only manual v8 ce so far but hope it will be the first of many !
While we are building it on a tight budget,we use it to test experimental conversion parts.
And yes it goes like hell !!.It also has a sound like a lambo that you can make great sound tracks
without having to drive fast.
Originally it was fitted with a long s class diff (2.24) that returned 38 mpg on a long run if you dont
let temptation get the better of you.On the down side this ratio doesnt line up with speed limits so
you are always having to drive in the next gear down.Now it has another s class diff of (2.65:1)
with lsd.1st gear is still very long and the accelaration is even better.Ive upset a lot of very
expensive sports cars on major roads with it!Now on a run it returns 33mpg.I use it daily around
Devon lanes and hills and average 30mpg,thats even while not hanging about overtaking like a
superbike.Its also great fun in garage forecourts and high streets as when you press the start button
it burst into life with a near seizemic event that gets everyones attention.Doesnt matter what kind of
day Im having,pressing that button always puts a smile on my face !.

Blankcanvas will soon take delivery of his 123 560ce manual,another first as far as we know.
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OSIRIS V8
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Hi rich27

Your right I hadnt noticed the wheely bin and to make things worse it was moved the next day.
I'll find a good setting and take some proper ones after washing it.Still got the bodywork to do yet though.
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stwat
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Sounds fantastic(as i bet it does in the flesh :D )

But how the feck do you manage such good MPG? :o I wish i could get those figures from my valver :lol:
Edited by stwat, Fri Jun 18, 2010 10:44 pm.
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Rich27
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OSIRIS V8
Fri Jun 18, 2010 10:41 pm
Hi rich27

Your right I hadnt noticed the wheely bin and to make things worse it was moved the next day.
I'll find a good setting and take some proper ones after washing it.Still got the bodywork to do yet though.
And it was scaring the poor Seat as well. :lol:
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OSIRIS V8
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Hi stwat,

Everyone under estimates the 117 engine and goes multi valve (no offence).The first and most important factor is the manual box.As 126's are getting on now,very few have a tight autobox so the engine is often reving waiting for the torqueconverter to catch up.The manual box is also alot lighter than an auto.Another advantage is cornering as the car isnt floating around a corner in freewheel.Another mod is using a series 1 distributer on a series 2 engine moves the peak of the torque curve down by nearly 1000rpm and makes replacement ignition modules a lot cheaper.
Although the engine has a large displacement,because the tourqe is available from 500rpm,a long legged diff can be used making the volume of fuel/air mixture used less than higher reving smaller engines.70mph is 1500rpm in 5th.Only having one camshaft on each cylinderhead also reduces the energy lost driving mechanical parts.
Ive also done away with other power sappers like aircon and the large cooling fan.Ive resisted the temptation of electric seats as that adds about another 20kg per seat.
The exhaust system is all stainless including the manifolds so not only does it sound amazing but again its much lighter than a standard sysyem.The bore is also balanced for maximum flow with minimum internal surface drag.
So far I have found that anything that increases power except multivalve also inproves fuel consumption when driven normally.(driven normally) in this car is about 20mph faster than most normal modern cars so unless you have a clear road infront of you,the car spends most of its time being held back.
We are currently experimenting with the later injection system to make engine more tunable and with much greater airflow for more power at higher revs.We are also playing with a new type of forced induction that doesnt have the back pressure and tempretures of a turbo and doesnt take energy from the engine like a supercharger.When we get it working properly it will pump in air at 2 degres c while only drawing energy during decelaration.The system princeple works well but we still have alot of work to do on the control mechanism.
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stwat
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I see. Thanks for all the info it does make sense :)

My 190 2.6 auto with its low down torque was better on fuel than my 2.3-16 is. I used to love cruising around on almost tickover B)
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OSIRIS V8
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Rich27
Fri Jun 18, 2010 10:44 pm
OSIRIS V8
Fri Jun 18, 2010 10:41 pm
Hi rich27

Your right I hadnt noticed the wheely bin and to make things worse it was moved the next day.
I'll find a good setting and take some proper ones after washing it.Still got the bodywork to do yet though.
And it was scaring the poor Seat as well. :lol:
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Got next doors seat completely surrounded in this one !A Merc in front that you cant see and 3 more bringing up the rear !!
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blankcanvas
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lovely car, its genuinely a weapon (tasty reg.)
consider the m117 engine
in the later gen 2 form 5 litre form could hurtle the weight of a w126 sel from 0 - 60 in about 7.2 seconds
and in 5.6 litre form could send it from 0 - 60 in 6.9 seconds

transplanted into lighter coupes , manual gearboxes , ignition tweaks , performance exhaust systems etc.,

the mind doth wonder :D
Edited by blankcanvas, Sat Jun 19, 2010 12:13 pm.
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Mohammad
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More please.

the Front lip is exactly how i would do once i acquire a 190E.
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blankcanvas
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weneakhborz
Sat Jun 19, 2010 12:19 pm
More please.

the Front lip is exactly how i would do once i acquire a 190E.
they're made in house for w124s , he may consider doing a w201 version?
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Johnboy Mac
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Great, brilliant stuff Osiris. I'll get more of the low down from Dan in due course. Keep us all posted and keep up the good work. :D
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OSIRIS V8
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The splitter is at present only for the 124's.We do plan to make a mould for 190's s2 but didnt have a spare bumper to make pattern on,until today.

Blankcanvas,
"Big G" bought a 190 2.6 today and is now trying to decide wether to put a 320 in it that we already have or wait to build a 3.6 for it.
Since he moved down here he has fully embraced my bad influence !!
Edited by OSIRIS V8, Sat Jun 19, 2010 9:15 pm.
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Johnboy Mac
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OSIRIS V8
Sat Jun 19, 2010 7:03 pm

Blankcanvas "Big G" bought a 190 2.6 today and is now trying to decide wether to put a 320 in it that we already have or wait to build a 3.6 for it.
Since he moved down here he has fully embraced my bad influence !!


I gathered. Will he ever know when to stop! :lol:


Edited by Johnboy Mac, Sat Jun 19, 2010 7:10 pm.
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OSIRIS V8
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Johnboy Mac
Sat Jun 19, 2010 7:08 pm
OSIRIS V8
Sat Jun 19, 2010 7:03 pm

Blankcanvas "Big G" bought a 190 2.6 today and is now trying to decide wether to put a 320 in it that we already have or wait to build a 3.6 for it.
Since he moved down here he has fully embraced my bad influence !!


I gathered. Will he ever know when to stop! :lol:


Hopefully not !
We havnt beaten the SLR yet but we're workin on it !!

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Johnboy Mac
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I'll call in sometime when down your way, it be worth while just to discuss Dan's potential new projects if nothing else. :D




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Benzsc1
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Thats one serious car and inspiration for me CE (one day ;) ) absolutely lovely mate and welcome to the forum btw. I also own a 124 300 CE-24 they really are great cars. I bet she moves along nicely ? ;) :)
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samm
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hi guys, just joined the forum after doing a little searching regarding a m119 5.0 swap into a w124 300E. I have the chance to buy a 92 500SL r129 off a friend for cheap and have always wanted a v8 conversion. very impressive work with the CE conversion, more pictures would be awesome.
Will the m119 fit into the engine bay without the steering column having to be modified? Im just guessing that most off the things can come off the 500 and fit on the w124 saloon, with obviously fabrication work. But the actual parts like te prop-shaft, differential, drive shafts would fit? Is the r129 a better donor car or a w126 for the w124 conversion?
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jeremy
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samm
Fri Dec 31, 2010 1:06 am
hi guys, just joined the forum after doing a little searching regarding a m119 5.0 swap into a w124 300E. I have the chance to buy a 92 500SL r129 off a friend for cheap and have always wanted a v8 conversion. very impressive work with the CE conversion, more pictures would be awesome.
Will the m119 fit into the engine bay without the steering column having to be modified? Im just guessing that most off the things can come off the 500 and fit on the w124 saloon, with obviously fabrication work. But the actual parts like te prop-shaft, differential, drive shafts would fit? Is the r129 a better donor car or a w126 for the w124 conversion?
This post raises certain questions ...

1. Why haven't you started your own thread ?

2. This is a 190 Forum , the clue is at the top of every page , so why post such a question here ?

Welcome by the way !


Jeremy
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maggot
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samm
Fri Dec 31, 2010 1:06 am
hi guys, just joined the forum after doing a little searching regarding a m119 5.0 swap into a w124 300E. I have the chance to buy a 92 500SL r129 off a friend for cheap and have always wanted a v8 conversion. very impressive work with the CE conversion, more pictures would be awesome.
Will the m119 fit into the engine bay without the steering column having to be modified? Im just guessing that most off the things can come off the 500 and fit on the w124 saloon, with obviously fabrication work. But the actual parts like te prop-shaft, differential, drive shafts would fit? Is the r129 a better donor car or a w126 for the w124 conversion?
Unless you are doing the work yourself it would probably be cheaper to buy a 500e and have it converted to rhd if you are that keen on a m119 V8 in the w124 body. If it's just about power, a forced induction inline six will be quicker anyway.
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gibpetrolhead
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There has been a 560 W123 before I think one of the classic car mags built it as a project, nice.

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Its being sold my Mercseller.com
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OSIRIS V8
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There has been a 560 W123 before I think one of the classic car mags built it as a project, nice.


yes this was one of mine !!
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OSIRIS V8
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samm
Fri Dec 31, 2010 1:06 am
hi guys, just joined the forum after doing a little searching regarding a m119 5.0 swap into a w124 300E. I have the chance to buy a 92 500SL r129 off a friend for cheap and have always wanted a v8 conversion. very impressive work with the CE conversion, more pictures would be awesome.
Will the m119 fit into the engine bay without the steering column having to be modified? Im just guessing that most off the things can come off the 500 and fit on the w124 saloon, with obviously fabrication work. But the actual parts like te prop-shaft, differential, drive shafts would fit? Is the r129 a better donor car or a w126 for the w124 conversion?
Hi,
Ive got a 119 engine to play with!
I offered cit in to a CE and found it possible but at great expense.
If the car is right hand drive,the steering box becomes the biggest problem.I think this could be solved by converting the steering to late e class steering rack.The fire wall needs replacing with pannels from a 500e.
The alternator on this engine hits the crumple zone,but there are several stock mounting options to sort this.
And ofcourse the wiring! the ecu for the 119 is the size of the battery because it links in with the ABS,ASD,SRS,AC and a few others via the base module not to mention the throttle body with cruise control and fly by wire.

Personally because weve beaten it,I think the 126 has more in common than the 129.Fuel consumption is also a factor thesedays.A 119 with steep power and torque curve will need shorter legs in the diff so you wont see the right side of 20 mpg.
As for power,you get an extra 30hp over a 117 560.
At present I am working on a completely new set up for the 117 by stripping off the entire fuel system including inlet manifold and replacing it with our own direct throttle bodies with high output injectors.Dumping the ignition system too.Then replacing it all with fully sequential digital system with multi map ecu.
Im still making all the new castings at this stage but the programme techies reckon we should be looking at 500+hp. Cant wait !!

Also working on similar for the 103 300 engine!

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gibpetrolhead
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OSIRIS V8
Sun Feb 20, 2011 1:51 am
There has been a 560 W123 before I think one of the classic car mags built it as a project, nice.


yes this was one of mine !!
It certainly is a fine car and you integrated the 560's engine and interior very well, looked factory. B)
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OSIRIS V8
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gibpetrolhead
Sun Feb 20, 2011 9:41 am
OSIRIS V8
Sun Feb 20, 2011 1:51 am
There has been a 560 W123 before I think one of the classic car mags built it as a project, nice.


yes this was one of mine !!
It certainly is a fine car and you integrated the 560's engine and interior very well, looked factory. B)
This one was built for a jornalist with practical classic mag on a tight budget.

Where ever possible i use stock parts to keep thing pure.Some parts have to be fabricated but im slowly replacing these with castings to catch up with merc quality.Evolution!!
An earlier car had to go for an engineers report.The engineer said "i can see its got an engine it shouldnt have,but i cant see where the old stops and the new begins"
The ultimate compliment i thought.

Just finnishing another one of these this week.
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gibpetrolhead
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The engineer said "i can see its got an engine it shouldnt have,but i cant see where the old stops and the new begins"
The ultimate compliment i thought.

Very ture I'm sure that brought forward a smile. :D

Anyway please feel the need to post pics and details on Just finnishing another one of these this week. B)
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OSIRIS V8
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I'll get on to that tomorrow!!.

I have a few toys to play with at the moment,
finnishing 123 500e for 3 pointed parts of Taunton.
A 123 560ce manual.
A 123 500ce with a head gasket issue,(told him not to buy engine already out on ebay).
A mint 190e being converted to 300 manual (up for sale when finnished).
A fully restored 1963 fintail now a 560.
And my 124 500ce (osiris 1!) having new brakes for mot.
3pointed parts has kept back a set of discs and calipers off a 140 500sel,they look like they came off an hgv.
They wont fit yet but I have a hunch with a caliper bracket machined out of forged steel they might help me land the thing after overtaking !!
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OSIRIS V8
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3pointed parts is a merc breaker with a lot of stock and reasonable prices.
Rob Parker who runs it is also into converting.He's done a few deisels and a 190 300 so far.

If anyone's interested we have a 250 turbo deisel c class engine down here with all the electrics etc.Just begging to become a 190d 250 turbo!
Edited by OSIRIS V8, Sun Feb 20, 2011 8:08 pm.
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gibpetrolhead
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OSIRIS V8
Sun Feb 20, 2011 7:46 pm
3pointed parts has kept back a set of discs and calipers off a 140 500sel,they look like they came off an hgv.
That's some list!! B)

A freind has a 98 S320 and most things on it are HGV like. :lol:
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OSIRIS V8
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Hers a thought! once ive made them fit a 124,they will also fit a 190 !! ;)
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gibpetrolhead
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OSIRIS V8
Sun Feb 20, 2011 8:13 pm
Hers a thought! once ive made them fit a 124,they will also fit a 190 !! ;)
Certainly would make a very tasty car. B) B)
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Lambo_Rambo
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What gearbox are you using?! As far as I know there isn't manual gearbox that fits M117 and M119 directly.. Cane you tell me the type of gearbox and what model is it from..
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Rich27
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I dont think you will get an answer from the owner Rambo as the last post on the thread before you ressurected it was 11 months ago.

I wonder if any of the other techs on the site will know?
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Lambo_Rambo
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Rich27
Mon Jan 16, 2012 10:06 am
I dont think you will get an answer from the owner Rambo as the last post on the thread before you ressurected it was 11 months ago.

I wonder if any of the other techs on the site will know?
I'm asking because currently I'm doing M119 conversion in 190E, I plan to use SL300-24 5spd dogleg manual gearbox, and I'm making an adapter plate, as far as I know M117 and M119 share the same bolt pattern on the bellhousing and I wander what gearbox did he use, because I'm not aware of a manual transmission for those engines..
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Paulossie
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Is it possible to convert a 92 300 or 500 sl to a manual if so what kind of cost are we talking and is it possible to pop down to Devon and have a chat about it some time, if so can you pm me or post your details please.
Cheers Paul
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Lambo_Rambo
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Paulossie
Mon Jan 16, 2012 9:45 pm
Is it possible to convert a 92 300 or 500 sl to a manual if so what kind of cost are we talking and is it possible to pop down to Devon and have a chat about it some time, if so can you pm me or post your details please.
Cheers Paul
I didn't understand if you were talking to me?.. R129 SL300-24 came with an manual (optional) 5 speed dogled non-getrag transmission, code 717.451, the same as 717.450, which was installed in W124 300-24/320, the 500 is different bellhousing bolt pattern, and I'm not aware of a manual transmission for that engine (M119)
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Paulossie
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Lambo_Rambo
Mon Jan 16, 2012 10:34 pm
Paulossie
Mon Jan 16, 2012 9:45 pm
Is it possible to convert a 92 300 or 500 sl to a manual if so what kind of cost are we talking and is it possible to pop down to Devon and have a chat about it some time, if so can you pm me or post your details please.
Cheers Paul
I didn't understand if you were talking to me?.. R129 SL300-24 came with an manual (optional) 5 speed dogled non-getrag transmission, code 717.451, the same as 717.450, which was installed in W124 300-24/320, the 500 is different bellhousing bolt pattern, and I'm not aware of a manual transmission for that engine (M119)
No it was directed to Orisis v8 cheers.
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