| Welcome to Mercedes-190.co.uk We are the Mercedes 190 owners forum, the place to be for all owners and fans of the Mercedes 190E, 190 and 190D cars. Including Cosworth (2.3 16v and 2.5 16v), EVO 1 and EVO 2 models. Modified and concourse, track cars and daily drivers, all are welcome. This free UK based forum was started back in November 2005 to serve the Mercedes 190 W201 community and now has over 9000 members from all around the world and 600,000 + posts. The members welcome you and encourage you to stay a while and have a look around. We offer you friendly chat and access to some very useful information as well as tutorials with photos and videos for many common repair and maintenance jobs. Whatever your needs there is a good chance you will be able to find what your looking for. Such as our Mercedes 190 buyers guide Sign up to gain access to all areas including for sale / classified areas and country wide meetings and events. Many forum features and sections are only available once you sign up. Join our forum at mercedes-190.co.uk! If you're already a member please log in to your account: **New members signing up** please check your junk mail for the email authorization email otherwise we cannot verify your new account. I have noticed a lot of unauthorized accounts in the system. Regards Admin |
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| Inherited my fathers 190e 2.5 16v; Newbie help required! | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Mon Nov 1, 2010 10:47 am (2,219 Views) | |
| firetrap | Mon Nov 1, 2010 10:47 am Post #1 |
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Newbie
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Hi all, i have just inherited my fathers pride and joy - his 190E 2.5 16v (auto), he has owned this car for approx 15years and has always loved it. Unfortunatley it has been stood for the last 3 years without being started due to fathers illness i now have ownership of the car, and ideally i would love to get it back on the road, i went to see it yesterday and i am led to believe that the car had some sort of computer fault when my father last used it and it was towed back to his house on the back of a truck and it was never used again. Generally it is in good condition on outside with a couple of small rust spots and some laquer peeling off the spoiler, interior is full leather and looks in good order, as for the engine - i have no idea on the state of it yet but am pretty sure it will never run in present condition! I would love to get this car back on the road and fully restored to its former glory, but i think it is going to have to be a 'project' as am guessing they are not cheap, or easy cars to fix so it may be sat in garage for a while yet! Just wondered if anyone on here would be willing to advise a newbie on these cars and possible common faults etc and if anyone knows of someone knowledgable/reasonably priced and is familiar with these cars who might be willing to take a look/help out with getting it running again - if so - please get in touch! (Peterborough area) I will have a look through all the related posts over the next few days/weeks, and hope to post some pics of this car one day! Thank you for reading and if anyone can help in any way please get in touch Best regards, Ian |
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| aemt | Mon Nov 1, 2010 10:58 am Post #2 |
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Serial 190E Owner
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Hallo and welcome to the forum. You will get all the help you need here. |
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| jeremy | Mon Nov 1, 2010 10:58 am Post #3 |
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Too Far Gone To Help
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Hi and welcome to the forum . About this time last year I was offered an Evo II that had been stood unused for 11 years . I am happy to say that nowadays it is used regularly by it's new owner who replaced very few parts in order to get it to this point . First off is to connect a good battery and see if the old girl will start . Does it have good oil pressure , it should go straight to 3 bar after a few seconds and stay there . Get back to us after that . Oh and some piccies would be nice Jeremy |
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| RobertE | Mon Nov 1, 2010 11:32 am Post #4 |
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Serial victim...
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I would imagine that there should not be any serious issues after three years, but I'd recommend the following: Whip out the plugs and put in some upper cylinder lubricant. Replace plugs. Connect a charge pack (or recharge battery). Disconnect the main cable to the coil. Turn over the engine on the starter until you have oil pressure. As said, the gauge should go to the top. Check the fuel distributor for gunge. Stick in some fresh petrol, as close to 100 octane as you can. Reconnect cable to coil. Start engine... Fingers crossed! |
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| firetrap | Mon Nov 1, 2010 11:45 am Post #5 |
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Newbie
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Thank you for your replies, i have a feeling i will not be as lucky in getting it going with only a few cheap parts lol - but you never know! i will get a decent battery for it and maybe try and see if i can get down at the weekend and see what happens, as for the oil pressure reading - if there is a gauge inside the car (that works, i did niotice a lcd gauge on the dash that is never going to work due to leaking) i can let you know the oil pressure, if not, im not going to pretend i know a great deal about cars and may struggle to get the reading! even after being stood (outside) for 3 years or so it is still a lovely looking car so will def get some pics up if and when i get it home and its had its first wash/polish lol.Please keep the ideas/advice coming - i need all the help i can get! Thanks |
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| RobertE | Mon Nov 1, 2010 12:07 pm Post #6 |
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Serial victim...
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If you can beg, borrow or steal a charge pack (I couldn't live without mine) then you will find things easier. Also, get some stuff called Plusgas and squirt the throttle plate in case it has stuck. These cars don't like sitting about, so the sooner you get its blood circulating, the better. You may also find that the brakes are seized, but don't worry about that at this point, as any rust (which will have built up) is quickly scrubbed off. And then, you will discover the pleasure and pain of owning one of these fine cars. You will learn that service parts are often ludicrously cheap from Mercedes, although many others are marked up to comedy levels. Example: Fuel dizzy from Bosch = £500. Same item from Mercedes = £2,000! |
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| jeremy | Mon Nov 1, 2010 2:12 pm Post #7 |
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Too Far Gone To Help
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The oil pressure gauge is the one of the four ( at the 3 o'clock position ) in the left hand dial behind the steering wheel Jeremy |
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| Big Ben | Mon Nov 1, 2010 3:03 pm Post #8 |
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Sneaky 2.5-16 Driver!
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Welcome! Was your Father a Forum Member by any chance? You've certainly come to the right place for advice and support for your car! |
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| firetrap | Mon Nov 1, 2010 3:22 pm Post #9 |
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Newbie
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Will make sure i make a note of oil pressure when i go over next, as for upper cylinder lubricant (RobertE post)... could you recommend any in particular please as i have no idea what to get Thanks again for help so far! Big Ben - i doubt my father was a member as he never used the computer! He certainly loved his merc though and for that reason i hope to learn as much as i can and get his baby back on the road! Edited by firetrap, Mon Nov 1, 2010 3:26 pm.
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| firetrap | Mon Nov 1, 2010 3:50 pm Post #10 |
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Newbie
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Update - i have just spoken to the local garage that i 'think' looked at the car around 3 years ago, although the chap said he could not really remember, he did say that he thought it could possibly be the 'injection rotor arm' not going round?? But he did seem pretty unsure and to be honest im not suprised, but may be a starting point if the car will not start - is this a big job to do? and more to the point.. is it a costly job? I am not in a position to just be able to take the car somewhere and say 'fix it please', i will have to try and sort as much out myself as possible and as cheaply as possible for now, and hopefully over time i will be able to save up and spend a bit here and there getting her looking good again! Just cant wait to get her up and running again for now! |
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| AgentOrange | Mon Nov 1, 2010 3:53 pm Post #11 |
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Guardian of Perspective
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Hello and welcome, I'm from the peterborough area too. Look foward to seeing the car restored
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| Enthusiast | Mon Nov 1, 2010 7:49 pm Post #12 |
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Part of things
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Well done, you should thank your Dad, you'll love it, soon plenty of help and parts available here.. |
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| Big Ben | Mon Nov 1, 2010 9:12 pm Post #13 |
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Sneaky 2.5-16 Driver!
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From what the mechanic said I would take it somewhere else! The injection system does not have a rotor arm. Its more likely to be something simple! If you cant sort it yourself you need to find someone local who understands K-Jetronic injection. I am sure there must be a local member with experience of 2.5-16's who could drop by and have a quick look? Shame you dont live near Bude!!
Edited by Big Ben, Mon Nov 1, 2010 9:12 pm.
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| Threepoint | Mon Nov 1, 2010 9:36 pm Post #14 |
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Part of things
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Hi Firetrap Good to have you wit us here on the forum. I am no expert but if I can do anything then pm me. I live near Peterborough and can pop over and have a look with you if you like. No experience with 2.5-16`s,but anyway..... |
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| pentoman | Mon Nov 1, 2010 10:47 pm Post #15 |
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Resident OVP Expert
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Surely its just got lost in translation and it should be ignition rotor arm. Easy to test for a backyard mechanic with experience. |
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| firetrap | Mon Nov 1, 2010 11:01 pm Post #16 |
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Newbie
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wow.. im just as glad i found this forum as i am to have the car! Thanks guys for all the help and advice so far - its much appreciated! No idea what to do to be honest, i might just go and take a look at the weekend along with a few tools, new battery and some petrol and follow some of the advice above and see what happens! at least then i can come back armed with a bit more info like oil pressure etc and see what the general opinion is? At least then im not wasting anyones time if the car does happen to start as it is currently half an hour away from pboro so its not just a ten min trip |
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| jeremy | Mon Nov 1, 2010 11:10 pm Post #17 |
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Too Far Gone To Help
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That's the spirit , once you get the car up and running you will soon understand what all the fuss is about . The best handling 4 door saloon ... ever . Jeremy |
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| merc190uk | Mon Nov 1, 2010 11:30 pm Post #18 |
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The Godfather
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best of luck with this project you really need to drain that old fuel out and change the oil/flush it through with fresh stuff as stated lube the pistons up and then try turning it over with a spanner on the crank first just to get a feel for the pistons and if they or valves etc are sticking if you just try to start it you will prob do more harm than good if your not too sure what to do then best getting all the advice you can before starting on the engine and have a friend that can help too worth it in the long run, its been off the road this long so i wouldnt rush it once you know your way around them they are not to bad a car to fix |
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| firetrap | Tue Nov 2, 2010 9:36 am Post #19 |
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Newbie
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Thats a plan then, ill go over (hopefully at weekend) drain the fuel - (is there an easy way to do this?) lube the pistons (advice on this would be helpfull), drain the oil and replace with new (is havoline - ultra synthetic 5w 40 ok to use? i have some already), and ill try turning the engine over with spanner on the crank before i do anything else! if the engine turns over ok by hand and once i have done the oil change and replaced fuel etc will it then be ok to try and start her up and see what happens? any more advice/info will be appreciated as i dont want to do more harm than good by rushing in and just trying to start it up too soon! Thanks again to everyone who has offered advice and help so far - must admit im getting pretty excited about getting it up and running now!
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| Salar | Tue Nov 2, 2010 9:52 am Post #20 |
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Salar Turk
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You seem to have a good plan, as for the fuel drain, I have never done it before and I guess its not that big deal; there should be a draining plug down there (better to consult the manual). To lube the pistons, I think it is a very easy task via the spark plug holes using a medical-purpose plastic injector (as I did once for exmple). As for the oil, it is the type I prefer to use with my Silver Star (wonderful quality). Also, it is a good idea to turn her stomach a little bit with a spanner to verify her ability to move, unless you would take the advice of our mate above who told you to disconect the coil cable and use a charger or whatever to turn her a little bit. All the best and inform us soon with some pics Salar |
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| aemt | Tue Nov 2, 2010 9:53 am Post #21 |
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Serial 190E Owner
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Semi synthetic 10-40W. |
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| Salar | Tue Nov 2, 2010 9:56 am Post #22 |
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Salar Turk
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Good idea mate for Winter, however the 5er is an all-condition preference
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| firetrap | Tue Nov 2, 2010 9:59 am Post #23 |
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Newbie
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what should i use to lube the pistons once i have removed the plugs? I may as well replace plugs if they are coming out anyways - any recomended plugs to use? sorry if some of these questions are stupid ones, i just want to do things right without causing any more probs than it may already have lol Edited by firetrap, Tue Nov 2, 2010 10:04 am.
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| Salar | Tue Nov 2, 2010 10:06 am Post #24 |
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Salar Turk
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You are definitely right; have you got one of these: http://www.google.ch/images?client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-GB%3Aofficial&hl=en&source=imghp&biw=1366&bih=552&q=needle+inject&gbv=2&aq=f&aqi=g2g-m1&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai= |
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| firetrap | Tue Nov 2, 2010 10:17 am Post #25 |
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Newbie
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Salar - yes i think i have a plastic syringe somewhere and am pretty sure i can find some tubing to fit the end! How much do i put into each cylinder and what am i putting in? |
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| Big Ben | Tue Nov 2, 2010 10:21 am Post #26 |
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Sneaky 2.5-16 Driver!
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Do not use multi point or split fire plugs our engines do not like them! Use standard copper core Bosch or Beru plugs. NGK work fine for a while but do not seem to last long! When you have run the car for a while there are other options but not worth doing until the engine has been proven!
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| Big Ben | Tue Nov 2, 2010 10:23 am Post #27 |
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Sneaky 2.5-16 Driver!
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![]() Redex from screwfix |
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| jeremy | Tue Nov 2, 2010 10:25 am Post #28 |
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Too Far Gone To Help
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I questioned all this when I wanted to start the Evo II . After much deliberation and advice sought from people who know these things , the answer was that modern oils have fantastic stickability even after many years of non-use . Robert's suggestion of pulling the HT lead off just to check whether there is full oil pressure is valid . But I doubt very much if any upper cylinder lube is required . My scrapper 2.3-16V started after about 10 seconds of cranking , after being laid up for seven years . The oil pressure showed after about 3 seconds , slightly longer than normal but still ok. I had heard from M-B owners who have dug cars out of 30+ year storage , stuck a battery on it and started it up . Jeremy |
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| Salar | Tue Nov 2, 2010 10:30 am Post #29 |
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Salar Turk
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Of course you are not going to fill it up; it all depends on the size of syringe. Anyway, a 1/4 to 1/2 is enough for each piston, as the purpose is a thin film rather than drowning. Please use the same type of oil you are going to pour into the case (the 5w-40 you mentioned for example). All the best and feel free to elaborate whenever in need. Salar |
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| Salar | Tue Nov 2, 2010 10:31 am Post #30 |
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Salar Turk
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Why not mate, they are working properly on mine. Salar |
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| Salar | Tue Nov 2, 2010 10:35 am Post #31 |
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Salar Turk
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I do agree with you Jeremy, however, for the sake of satisfying our worries and for much more security for the engine, I would rather myself go for oiling them before trying to start her up, even after one year only of stand-still. Salar |
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| Big Ben | Tue Nov 2, 2010 10:37 am Post #32 |
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Sneaky 2.5-16 Driver!
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Yours isnt a 16 valve. They used to work fine in my old 2.0 but our 3 (now 2) valvers appreciably lost power and gave problems starting. Nicks auto runs a standard set up using Bosch copper core plugs but we have changed the manual to Magnecor leads and Denso iridium plugs with good results. |
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| Salar | Tue Nov 2, 2010 10:39 am Post #33 |
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Salar Turk
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Definitely right, this is a 16 valver, sorry.
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| Mohammad | Tue Nov 2, 2010 12:22 pm Post #34 |
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weneakhborz
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hello and welcome ,mate. you are for sure at the best place for the 190s. and once you run the car,you will understand why we love these cars this much. take it easy and i hope you get it running in a proper shape. |
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| Salar | Tue Nov 2, 2010 12:26 pm Post #35 |
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Salar Turk
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By the way, that is a nice product you showed there
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| RobertE | Tue Nov 2, 2010 1:25 pm Post #36 |
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Serial victim...
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By the way, if you are going to turn over the engine by hand, you'll need a 27mm socket to grab the nose of the crank. Best, Robert |
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| firetrap | Tue Nov 2, 2010 2:04 pm Post #37 |
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Newbie
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Thanks RobertE, ill be sure to get one! On order is; spark plugs oil filter air filter fuel filter distributer cap rotor arm battery plusgas lubricant. All i got to do first is get it here and i can start work! I can't wait to start tinkering lol |
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| jeremy | Tue Nov 2, 2010 3:13 pm Post #38 |
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Too Far Gone To Help
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Get some jump leads too ... and DON'T use the starter motor for long periods without letting it cool down , they can burn out if used for very long cranks . Oh , and have patience , take your time and do it bit by bit . It's easy to do lots of damage under the bonnet with one ill tempered swipe . Jeremy |
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| Salar | Tue Nov 2, 2010 3:20 pm Post #39 |
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Salar Turk
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I totally agree with Jeremy, patience then patience then patience ! mechanics needs that type of stubborn, step-counting and careful guy, who would consider the matter thoroughly; culturally speaking, to reach somewhere safe with one month walking is better than jumping over a river and drowning !! All the best |
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| bolide | Tue Nov 2, 2010 4:09 pm Post #40 |
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Bolide
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Sorry to hear about your dad. #1 thing is to get the car on a classic insurance policy with an agreed value. #2 thing is to see if it is SORN. If it's not you should declare SORN right away and deal with whose name the car is in If it doesn't have MOT or tax you'll need to get it ready for an MOT. It's legal to drive it to a pre-booked test at a testing station without an MOT. Not sure about the tax situation but you can't tax it without an MOT so you have to start somewhere Sounds like you need to find your local MB specialist and get on first name terms with him I would let anyone fiddle with mixture settings & etc apart from a specialist with diagnostic gear. It's easy to screw things up due to lack of knowledge Final thing: be brutal in your assessment of the car before spending money. If it's rusting merrily it will cost more to fix than it is worth Nick Froome www.w124.co.uk |
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![]](http://z2.ifrm.com/static/1/pip_r.png)
i now have ownership of the car, and ideally i would love to get it back on the road, i went to see it yesterday and i am led to believe that the car had some sort of computer fault when my father last used it and it was towed back to his house on the back of a truck and it was never used again. Generally it is in good condition on outside with a couple of small rust spots and some laquer peeling off the spoiler, interior is full leather and looks in good order, as for the engine - i have no idea on the state of it yet but am pretty sure it will never run in present condition!




so will def get some pics up if and when i get it home and its had its first wash/polish lol.




3:46 PM Jul 11