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| Rust, MOT failure. | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Wed Sep 27, 2017 2:08 pm (609 Views) | |
| Lawrence90-2.6 | Wed Sep 27, 2017 2:08 pm Post #1 |
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Newbie
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Hi there, Advice for a stranger if I may. Just had the car at the garage for the annual service and MOT. MOT failed, three jacking mounts have excessive corrosion and around the rear window and boot hinges is a similar story. Well known points on the 190’s I’m aware. The body shop my local garage uses have said the rear shelf is too far gone and they wouldn’t actually take it on. The rust that has surfaced over the last year is significant and quiteshocking, not even mentioned or given an advisory last year. The quotes I’ve got for the welding are very hefty. I’m really, really, gutted about this. Had the car almost ten years myself and the previous two owners were extended family before that. Not good enough to ever undertake work myself but have always had work done that’s been recommend/suggested, genuine Merc parts etc., spent a lot over the years. Can anyone advise me please at what point with rust is it time to call it a day? Or if there is a body work genie out there worth talking to? Thank you for your time. Lawrence |
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| Chunk | Wed Sep 27, 2017 3:12 pm Post #2 |
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Spammer Zapper
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Hi there I know its as bad as aking to see pics of a car accident victim, but any pics of the bad bits? Shame there are a few bad design points on 190's. Hopefully it can be saved. Poss cut the shelf out of a breaker. A few being broken on the for sale section Fingers crossed for you |
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| Lawrence90-2.6 | Wed Sep 27, 2017 3:46 pm Post #3 |
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I can certainly arrange pictures at the weekend, unfortunately its dark when I leave in the morning and dark when I get home… not sure how well they’d come out with a torch… Thanks, desperate to keep it going. |
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| Greek Taxi | Wed Sep 27, 2017 4:02 pm Post #4 |
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More than part of things
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Is it the jacking points that caused the MOT fail? The rust around the screen wouldn't cause a fail, would it? Jacking points plated up by a competent welder, then slathered in wax etc, shouldn't cost much to repair. The rear windscreen is a bigger job of course, because it has to come out. Decent welders are hard to find, but I suggest you ask around. I eventually found a great guy near me through word of mouth, he runs a back-street garage so he generally welds to keep bangers going for longer, but he's skilled and enjoys getting the torch out. A good mix of cheap/proper job. If you're persevering with the car, I suggest you get all the Sacco panels off, look around the rear subframe, wheel arches and behind the front bumper. You don't want to spend money then find more horrors that the MoT man missed. Anything can be saved, but we've all got our own ideas about where the 'too far gone' line is. Edited by Greek Taxi, Wed Sep 27, 2017 4:03 pm.
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| Hu99u | Wed Sep 27, 2017 4:09 pm Post #5 |
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More than part of things
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If you sell the car pop me a message as I may be interested in buying it if you can't get it repaired. |
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| Lawrence90-2.6 | Wed Sep 27, 2017 8:16 pm Post #6 |
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Newbie
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Yes, it is the jacking points causing the MOT failure. I'll search around as you suggest, the garage I've always used in London quoted around £800 for welding the jack points and they said it could be more. The window obviously needs doing too as I'm sure this is a major contributor to the rust around the base of the car. Apart from simply having it back on the road I can't see much point in doing one without the other. I'm based in Surrey if anyone can recommend someone down this way? I had the gearbox re-done last year and have always intended to keep the car for the long haul, love the thing. Thanks for the advice. If there comes a time I'm considering selling it I'll keep the forum in mind. |
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| Will | Wed Sep 27, 2017 8:59 pm Post #7 |
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Highly Addicted
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Hi Lawrence, Where abouts are you based? To be honest if they're doing a proper job £800 for the jacking points isn't unreasonable. Some people plate over them but then you're leaving the rusty metal there to continue rotting away unseen causing more damage in the long term. It'll get through an MOT perhaps but then you don't sound as though that's you're only concern if you've already had it ten years? The screen is a well known problem area, I think the rear screen seal leaks and water pools onto the parcel shelf and enters the boot. Have you looked around the spare wheel well and behind the plastic liners on the rear wings etc? I guess it's a point in time to decide whether to restore or not. If the rest of the car is in good mechanical and cosmetic condition and you're attached to it (sentimental value) then go for it. Values are increasing anyway and I guess you've saved a packet in depreciation over the last ten years than some of the more modern cars
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| Daliscar | Wed Sep 27, 2017 9:02 pm Post #8 |
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Always On The Ball
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You can't do this type of work yourself? If it got through a test in 2016 how can it be this bad in a year ? As said, can you post any pictures? Let's concentrate on the sills first. |
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| Lawrence90-2.6 | Wed Sep 27, 2017 9:32 pm Post #9 |
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Newbie
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Hi there, Just moved to a small village past Godalming, south of Guildford. It's far from just the MOT, as you say, it holds a lot of sentimental value too. First car and all. I've still got the old sales brochure the original owner circled the model and extras he wanted on it. Spare wheel bay seems pretty solid as are the arches, slight surface rust on one, I've poked at it pretty hard. I'd love to have it fully redone, last year I might have but house purchase/wedding coming/ boring life stuff is currently in the way. I prefer the old cars to modern ones too in truth... I say I can't do it myself, I've never welded anything before, put it that way... I'll arrange picture as the weekend. Thanks for all your help. Lawrence |
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| scherrit | Thu Sep 28, 2017 12:01 am Post #10 |
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Part of things
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I have a good welder in Newbury if that's not too far, he did my rear screen surround rust work. Job including the spraying was around £800 IIRC? |
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| martinw190 | Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:29 am Post #11 |
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Part of things
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So, even if you don't find any further rust under the Sacco panels or elsewhere, you're looking at a significant bill for good quality repairs. £1500-2000? The question is, are you willing to pay that out to retain the same car and keep using it, or would you rather put that money towards a different 190 that has a far better shell? They are around, so that's an option. My big concern would be, is the rust that you've found the end of it? Or are you going to get another bill next year, or the year after. Those are notorious rust spots, but the 190s that rust there sometimes rust badly elsewhere too, unseen until you start stripping the car. I see it like this: cost-wise, owning an older car costs the same as owning newer ones; you can buy a new car every 5 or 10 years and you lose on depreciation, or you hang on to the old one, but every now and then you have to fork out for expensive repairs that newer cars don't get to. A good 190 is better than many in that regard, and it's a good investment if you get the right one, in that you're not pouring money into a black hole. Good repairs will last, then in 20 years time, you've had another 20 years motoring and the £5k you pay for a full bare metal rebuild seems cheap! Other classic car owners do this all the time. You don't scrap a 1953 Riley because of rust, you repair it. 190s aren't rare enough yet to justify that, but if the car means a lot to you, it does justify the expense if you then go on to get a lot of use out of the car. After all, you'd happily pay £5k say for a used car to last you 10 years, why not put £5k into your 190 instead? With zero depreciation, that's £500 a year cost of ownership.....2 months PCP payments! Edited by martinw190, Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:30 am.
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| Tartboy | Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:45 am Post #12 |
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For reference I just had a complete sill replaced with both jacking points rebuilt as well as 2 holes in one of the rear arches for a price of £750 plus the cost of the sill. The guy I used in based in Cooksbridge, East Sussex and comes highly recommended, not the cheapest but exceptional quality which is what you need if you want the repairs to last. http://www.alexorourkewelding.co.uk/ |
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| Daveycooper | Thu Sep 28, 2017 8:11 pm Post #13 |
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Part of things
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Sounds like one garage didnt want the work so just fobbed you off. Go on checkatrade/yell/google and search for car welder or car bodyshops in your area. I bet someone is more than happy to do the work. Dont throw a much loved car on the scrapheap on one persons say-so. Just set aside a couple of hours and ring around several people. Ive renovated a house and cars and the number of times a tradesman has said "cant or wont do that" only to have another more helpful tradesman say 'no bother''! |
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| Daliscar | Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:03 pm Post #14 |
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Always On The Ball
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Some good advice coming up on this thread. Hope it helps Lawrence
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| Oddbod | Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:23 pm Post #15 |
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Addicted
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The rear window is not bonded in so it is not overly difficult to remove and to replace it. I hope that this helps. |
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| Lawrence90-2.6 | Fri Sep 29, 2017 4:40 pm Post #16 |
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Newbie
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scherrit - Thanks for the suggestion, I’ve contacted a couple of people closer to home and will await their response. I’ll keep this in mind though, cheers. martinw190 – You’re absolutely spot on with your with your thoughts and this is what I’m attempting to get to the bottom of/understand. I have no problem waiting, getting the money together and having work done, as long as it’s not a pointless endeavour. I’ll get the panels off and try and get the full picture of the extent of the rust as you suggest. At the end of the day there are simply to limits to what can be repaired, however reluctant someone is to admit it, and I understand that. I have contacted a couple of restoration companies ( www.john-haynes.com being one) I’m sure the cost would be astronomic, first impressions they are very professional, I’ll see what they have to say. Tartboy – Thanks for the recommendation. I’m certainly going to keep them in mind, sounds good for both jobs. Daveycooper/Daliscar – Thanks for the posts guys. Oddbod – Thanks for the advice, I had a couple of people tell me they could be pressurised..? Thanks for all the help guys, great friendly forum. |
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| BrunoSaccofan | Mon Dec 11, 2017 7:27 pm Post #17 |
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Any update? Hopefully a happy ending. I understand the conflict. A very tough spot and hard decision. |
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